Comments on: I Beg to Differ http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/ Repo(ssess) Repro(ductive Justice): Bringing Rights within Reach Tue, 06 Jan 2009 21:57:28 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.2 By: Caitlin http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-769 Caitlin Tue, 15 Jul 2008 15:31:08 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-769 I know I'm WAY late on this but anyway... I'm definitely tired of democratic politicians using anti-choice/conservative rhetoric when discussing abortion. I thought the link/post below provided a really useful critique of Obama's recent abortion-related comments, and also usefully provided a more progressive way to frame the issue, even while appealing to less pro-choice voters who still support comprehensive sex ed (as the vast majority of Americans do). http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/07/05/obama-and-the-acceptable-abortion/ I don't mind a dialogue on this issue, so long as the dialogue doesn't turn into pro-choice politicians expressing their stance reluctantly-- there are very significant moral reasons to support abortion access (gender equality, women's autonomy, and many more) which aren't a large enough part of the mainstream abortion discussion. I know I’m WAY late on this but anyway…

I’m definitely tired of democratic politicians using anti-choice/conservative rhetoric when discussing abortion. I thought the link/post below provided a really useful critique of Obama’s recent abortion-related comments, and also usefully provided a more progressive way to frame the issue, even while appealing to less pro-choice voters who still support comprehensive sex ed (as the vast majority of Americans do).
http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/07/05/obama-and-the-acceptable-abortion/

I don’t mind a dialogue on this issue, so long as the dialogue doesn’t
turn into pro-choice politicians expressing their stance reluctantly–
there are very significant moral reasons to support abortion access
(gender equality, women’s autonomy, and many more) which aren’t a
large enough part of the mainstream abortion discussion.

]]> By: Marc Irish http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-387 Marc Irish Wed, 16 Apr 2008 17:10:26 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-387 I totally agree that there always seems to be an underlying sense of judgment/morality that comes into play on the issue of abortion. I've always been bothered that some of the "loudest" and shrillest moralists are males. When it comes down to it we don't have to make the ultimate decision and then live with the consequences, except as a more "intellectual" exercise. This is one reason why I think women particularly should be listened to on this issue. I also agree that having an abortion is the correct choice -- incest, rape, child would unduly suffer if born, health of the mother, etc. I guess I may be putting too fine a point on the discussion to use the words "good choice" as opposed to "correct choice". I totally agree that there always seems to be an underlying sense of judgment/morality that comes into play on the issue of abortion. I’ve always been bothered that some of the “loudest” and shrillest moralists are males. When it comes down to it we don’t have to make the ultimate decision and then live with the consequences, except as a more “intellectual” exercise. This is one reason why I think women particularly should be listened to on this issue.

I also agree that having an abortion is the correct choice — incest, rape, child would unduly suffer if born, health of the mother, etc. I guess I may be putting too fine a point on the discussion to use the words “good choice” as opposed to “correct choice”.

]]> By: Jen http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-385 Jen Wed, 16 Apr 2008 04:00:31 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-385 I sense he is trying to push the "prevention" line when he says we should help people "avoid" having to make a difficult decision. But I feel like anyone who brings up the word "morality" is really saying that keeping the pregnancy is always a more moral choice. There's a sense of judgment underlying the discussion. The fact is, I know plently of women for whom abortion was a good choice and I'm not afraid to say it. I sense he is trying to push the “prevention” line when he says we should help people “avoid” having to make a difficult decision. But I feel like anyone who brings up the word “morality” is really saying that keeping the pregnancy is always a more moral choice. There’s a sense of judgment underlying the discussion. The fact is, I know plently of women for whom abortion was a good choice and I’m not afraid to say it.

]]> By: Marc Irish http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-384 Marc Irish Wed, 16 Apr 2008 02:11:35 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-384 I'm always torn between wanting the politician I support to "lay it on the line" and speak the absolute, unvarnished truth and having he/she tone down the rhetoric somewhat so that they will appeal to a broader set of voters thus getting elected. The next steps are for he/she to move us in the correct (I can't use right) direction! My sense is and my hope is that this is what Obama will do once he is elected. I’m always torn between wanting the politician I support to “lay it on the line” and speak the absolute, unvarnished truth and having he/she tone down the rhetoric somewhat so that they will appeal to a broader set of voters thus getting elected. The next steps are for he/she to move us in the correct (I can’t use right) direction! My sense is and my hope is that this is what Obama will do once he is elected.

]]> By: Julie http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-383 Julie Tue, 15 Apr 2008 23:22:50 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-383 I hope you're right, Marc. I definitely have my hackles up a bit on this issue, because I am frustrated that politicians are constantly trying to make their support of abortion rights as lukewarm as possible. It's frustrating to hear politicians call abortion "never a good thing" -- even if it is intended to open dialogue and recognize the complexity of the issue -- simply because, as I say in the post, I just don't think that's true. Yes, abortion is fraught and difficult...but it can be those things and good too. I do agree with you that Obama is trying to build consensus here (as he has done in other areas -- and mostly with success). I just wish he could do it without that language. I hope you’re right, Marc. I definitely have my hackles up a bit on this issue, because I am frustrated that politicians are constantly trying to make their support of abortion rights as lukewarm as possible. It’s frustrating to hear politicians call abortion “never a good thing” — even if it is intended to open dialogue and recognize the complexity of the issue — simply because, as I say in the post, I just don’t think that’s true. Yes, abortion is fraught and difficult…but it can be those things and good too. I do agree with you that Obama is trying to build consensus here (as he has done in other areas — and mostly with success). I just wish he could do it without that language.

]]> By: Marc Irish http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-382 Marc Irish Mon, 14 Apr 2008 18:52:21 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-382 What I think Senator Obama is trying to do is to open up the conversation and keep it going so that each side of this issue will continue to dialogue. I listened to what he said at the Compassion forum and my sense is that he was trying to get folks to realize that this is a very touchy issue for lots of folks. In the end, he said it was really a personal choice that had to be made by each individual and that the government needs to back away and leave things where they lay today. Again, my sense is that he was hoping to get people to "walk in each others shoes" before rushing to some kind of judgement. He certainly is more open to listening to others opinions than any of the other candidates. He has also demonstrated that he is willing to listen and reform his opinions too. What I think Senator Obama is trying to do is to open up the conversation and keep it going so that each side of this issue will continue to dialogue. I listened to what he said at the Compassion forum and my sense is that he was trying to get folks to realize that this is a very touchy issue for lots of folks. In the end, he said it was really a personal choice that had to be made by each individual and that the government needs to back away and leave things where they lay today. Again, my sense is that he was hoping to get people to “walk in each others shoes” before rushing to some kind of judgement. He certainly is more open to listening to others opinions than any of the other candidates. He has also demonstrated that he is willing to listen and reform his opinions too.

]]> By: julie http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-381 julie Mon, 14 Apr 2008 17:06:39 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-381 I'm not so sure, Greg. Seems to me that Obama (of whom I am a supporter) was saying to a conservative crowd that abortion is a necessary evil. I'm not sure I want to endorse a portrayal in those terms. Certainly women don't get pregnant just to have abortions. But a lot of women with unplanned pregnancies think legal abortion is a good thing. I’m not so sure, Greg. Seems to me that Obama (of whom I am a supporter) was saying to a conservative crowd that abortion is a necessary evil. I’m not sure I want to endorse a portrayal in those terms. Certainly women don’t get pregnant just to have abortions. But a lot of women with unplanned pregnancies think legal abortion is a good thing.

]]> By: Greg http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-380 Greg Mon, 14 Apr 2008 13:53:20 +0000 http://reporepro.lsrj.org/2008/04/14/i-beg-to-differ/#comment-380 You really need to lighten up... If I say that Kidney Dialysis is never a good thing, does that necessarily mean that I don't believe it's good to have available? Of course not. What Senator Obama was refering to is the fact that abortion is never a pleasant thing, and although he is aware of and acknowledges the difficult decision that a woman has to make regarding this issue, he is also aware that no one wants to actually back themselves into having to make this decision. e.g. I've never heard of a woman wanting to have sex and get pregnant just so she could have an abortion. I really don't think that Senator Obama was refering to the availability of abortion. You really need to lighten up… If I say that Kidney Dialysis is never a good thing, does that necessarily mean that I don’t believe it’s good to have available? Of course not. What Senator Obama was refering to is the fact that abortion is never a pleasant thing, and although he is aware of and acknowledges the difficult decision that a woman has to make regarding this issue, he is also aware that no one wants to actually back themselves into having to make this decision. e.g. I’ve never heard of a woman wanting to have sex and get pregnant just so she could have an abortion.

I really don’t think that Senator Obama was refering to the availability of abortion.

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